Curse

MisterB · Sep 10, 2009, 10:48 PM // 22:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by stretchs

There was a tiny update today, but it was pretty small, and no notes posted yet

Guild Wars Wiki notes:

* Dizhou [Xunlai Pollster] has been removed from the Great Temple of Balthazar.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Game_updates/20090910

stretchs · Sep 10, 2009, 10:58 PM // 22:58

User posted not by anet

Z'HA'DUM · Sep 10, 2009, 11:06 PM // 23:06

There will be the good, the bad and the ugly.

People will clap their hands and cheer, others will rip their garments apart in despair.

Many happy faces will be seen, but much more sad faces will dominate the scenery.

There will be shouts of praise and words of threat.

The content ones will put on their best sunday clothes, while the hypocrites will wear sackcloth and mourn in the marketplaces.

The happy will eat, drink and enjoy themselves. The murmurers will fast and pull long faces and cover their skin with ashes.

Amen.

lutz · Sep 10, 2009, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

VoR is still OP in 4v4. Coupled with Backfire, it compels 4v4 players to either run dual hex rip, run a fail hex rip like Remove Hex, or face a VERY heavy pressure window for ten seconds out of every minute. And that's before we consider the ability to remove hexes from the remainder of the team or the possibility of Diversion.

Monk bars are tight. You shouldn't have to give up a slot in your build due to the combination of two skills. Sure, you could revert Backfire back to 30 if you wanted and solve the problem that way. But either way, the VoR bar in its present form is clearly OP in 4v4.

I agree that Primal is not OP in GvG, but there's a reason it's everywhere in HA. If you don't run it and they do, they spike more often than you, and you lose all else equal. You can't spike the warriors constantly; good ones anticipate visually and cancel, so you're spiking 96/106 armor targets to what purpose? Sure, you can't run relics with PR, but the Warriors should be off disrupting the opposition while casters run.

GvG is not the only format that needs to be balanced. You've already admitted that nerfing PR/VoR won't impact GvG in any way. So fixing them for the formats they need fixing in does no harm and does significant good.

VoR and Backfire aren't the problem.
It's the other magical skill that breaks the bar.

Fortunately, it's being fixed, a little bit too harshly I would say, but nevertheless being fixed.

Nerfing PR/VoR does impact GvG.

Krill · Sep 10, 2009, 11:51 PM // 23:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

It's the other magical skill that breaks the bar.

Hmmm, well if it's resolve you're referring too, it will be nice to finally be able to interrupt them but I don't think it will kill the build unless there is a more comprehensive regression of hex power creep.

Bob Slydell · Sep 11, 2009, 01:19 AM // 01:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by stretchs

User posted not by anet

All it takes is for someone to notice it, post it and other people to confirm it, not hard to do.

Puddin Cheeks · Sep 11, 2009, 04:30 AM // 04:30

no they will leave the R/A crap build alone cause they haven't figured to fix touch rangers in 4 years either. I'm tired of every R nub spamming Troll Unguent constantly. Not really a problem but just annoying to me.

Martin Alvito · Sep 11, 2009, 05:46 AM // 05:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

VoR and Backfire aren't the problem.
It's the other magical skill that breaks the bar.

Which was, coincidentally, a balanced skill for YEARS. If buffing other skills makes that skill overpowered, how are the buffs not the problem? I didn't understand this when the entire standard Mesmer bar was nerfed in lieu of nerfing Recovery, and I don't understand it now. Sometimes buffs are bad. Refusing to admit the error risks compounding it.

Regardless, hitting that skill won't solve the 4v4 problem I referred to. The bar simply produces more hex threats that must be countered than any single bar should be compelled to handle 4v4.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

Nerfing PR/VoR does impact GvG.

I can see the argument with VoR. But I'm not seeing PR when I obs highly-ranked teams. If it isn't in the meta, and it doesn't counter some prospective build that could emerge and alter the meta, how does it matter?

Are you arguing that a significant share of warriors will be carrying PR again after the impending nerfs?

Quote:

Originally Posted by runchippyrun

mesmers would be almost useless in 4v4 which would force more balanced and less hex pressured meta games back into 4v4.

I seem to remember Soul Bind/condition pressure being everywhere before the VoR buff. Just because a build gets crowded out of the meta doesn't imply that it wouldn't be viable if another similar build leaves. You don't have to have mesmer hexes to pressure a team with hexes.

DreamWind · Sep 11, 2009, 05:56 AM // 05:56

I don't think there is going to be a skill balance. I think the dog ate the balance sheet.

lutz · Sep 11, 2009, 07:59 AM // 07:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Alvito

Which was, coincidentally, a balanced skill for YEARS. If buffing other skills makes that skill overpowered, how are the buffs not the problem? I didn't understand this when the entire standard Mesmer bar was nerfed in lieu of nerfing Recovery, and I don't understand it now. Sometimes buffs are bad. Refusing to admit the error risks compounding it.

Regardless, hitting that skill won't solve the 4v4 problem I referred to. The bar simply produces more hex threats that must be countered than any single bar should be compelled to handle 4v4.

I can see the argument with VoR. But I'm not seeing PR when I obs highly-ranked teams. If it isn't in the meta, and it doesn't counter some prospective build that could emerge and alter the meta, how does it matter?

Are you arguing that a significant share of warriors will be carrying PR again after the impending nerfs?

I seem to remember Soul Bind/condition pressure being everywhere before the VoR buff. Just because a build gets crowded out of the meta doesn't imply that it wouldn't be viable if another similar build leaves. You don't have to have mesmer hexes to pressure a team with hexes.

It's really just a lot of problems rolling on each other.

First it was the really insane monk elites (LoD, WoH) that singlehandedly kept teams up, then the "overpowered" shutdown (Signet of Humility, Resolve+shutdown), then the defense stacking. If it wasn't for these single skills that are so powerful, we wouldn't be in this power creep situation.

GoreTor · Sep 11, 2009, 08:01 AM // 08:01

bloodspam. kill it.

My New Name · Sep 11, 2009, 08:11 AM // 08:11

kill expertise in PvP. It seems the only rational thing to do...

Meridon · Sep 11, 2009, 09:20 AM // 09:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamWind

I don't think there is going to be a skill balance. I think the dog ate the balance sheet.

The most win post in this topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelorin Eshmar

kill expertise in PvP. It seems the only rational thing to do...

So, Anet buffs assassin skills, lame R/A meta appears, and now Expertise is the problem? Just nerf the sin skills back, and/or tie a few of them to Critical Strikes.

Scary · Sep 11, 2009, 09:32 AM // 09:32

O nooooo, this is getting a other skill bashing thread.. plsss close

drunknzelda · Sep 11, 2009, 10:05 AM // 10:05

I would be glad to see some seriour change to blood magic for a change, they tried nerfing it but it was a big fail and it's still a problem in GvG.

ele pl · Sep 11, 2009, 12:20 PM // 12:20

Quote:

So, Anet buffs assassin skills, lame R/A meta appears, and now Expertise is the problem? Just nerf the sin skills back, and/or tie a few of them to Critical Strikes.

Lolwut? Expertise WAS ALWAYS a problem. How many times it was suggested? Doesnt matter, heres again the same suggestion: make Expertise work only with Ranger skills.

Redvex · Sep 11, 2009, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by ele pl

Lolwut? Expertise WAS ALWAYS a problem. How many times it was suggested? Doesnt matter, heres again the same suggestion: make Expertise work only with Ranger skills.

Expertise is ok dont' be boring.

Martin Alvito · Sep 11, 2009, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

If it wasn't for these single skills that are so powerful, we wouldn't be in this power creep situation.

Yes, Nightfall's overpowered elites pretty much destroyed the integrity of the game. Thank you, ANet Marketing, for succumbing to the same syndrome that has destroyed countless RPGs and CCGs over the years.

Killing the cow for the milk is always a poor idea.

Xanthe Dashka · Sep 11, 2009, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Aion will be released before the next huge update...

So yeah... Probably has no interesting content anyway to keep me in GW.

Karate Jesus · Sep 11, 2009, 02:32 PM // 14:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowerpoke

what happend with expanding the so called live team? their updates are getting less and less. skill balance updates are now supposed to be every 2months, anything else just seems to randomly appear.

They added a guy, but I think the majority of what they're doing now is just automating GW so they don't have to mess with it. I'd bet we get a decent Halloween/Wintersday and then that's probably the last we'll see of content updates.